
Daniel Plain
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
776
|
Posted - 2013.01.20 06:36:00 -
[2] - Quote
Arazel Chainfire wrote:Personally, I don't really care about the argument of the T3 vs. the HAC. I care about the argument of the T3 vs. the damn command ship...
Lets compare fits that are generally designed to be equivalent (aka, not worrying about interdiction nullification, covops cloaking, scanning, and command links, which CCP already is planning to address).
Loki v Slepnir Loki: can be effectively armor tanked can have web range bonus speed/agility advantage sig advantage better EHP Slepnir: more dps a better active tank (maybe...)
In this comparison, the big thing that needs to change is that the slepnir should be able to manage better EHP than the loki. Maybe it should have to choose between having more EHP or more DPS than the loki, and only get 1 or the other, but as it is if you want EHP to see you through a fight, you fly a loki. It is slower, hit harder (with its larger sig), and the loki can have the web range bonus. I'm not sure whether or not the slepnir should have the opportunity to armor tank.
Proteus V Astarte Proteus: more ehp point/scram range bonus smaller sig more agility/speed better active tank Astarte: more dps
umm... well. Why the hell would you ever fly an astarte? Actually, I can't tell you the last time I saw one. And the additional dps of the astarte is kind of lost with the reduction in the ability to get in range to apply it (and of course the significanly less EHP available to survive getting in range). Once again, the astarte needs to have SOME reason to make it worth flying over flying a proteus.
Nighthawk V tengu Tengu dps is about even with missile fit can actually fit HAM's missile range bonus speed/agility sig radius active tank EHP (this is kind of close, but the tengu can generally manage better EHP) Nighthawk: Has drones...
Ok, so the nighthawk barely compares favorably even to a drake, and can't really even fit HAM's either. It really is an insult to even try to compare it to the tengu - lets just leave it at the nighthawk needs ALOT of love, but it really needs the ability to actually put HAM's on a viable fit, and it really needs to be able to manage either noticeably more dps and/or noticeably more tank than the tengu.
Lastly, Legion V Absolution Legion: Range speed/agility sig radius active tank buffer tank Absolution: Dps drones
In this case, you may actually manage to get an absolution with better EHP than a legion (though it will loose its dps advantage if it attempts to do so). This may or may not be acceptible. However, the absolution encounters difficulties in actually applying its dps, as it suffers from 50% less range than the legion, as well as less maneuverability. Absolutions are at least more common to see than astarte's, though I still can't remember the last time I actually saw one being used. The absolution needs a buff, but probably less so than either the astarte or the nighthawk.
Conclusion - I don't care if the T3's are better than HAC's at everything. What needs to change is the T3's being better than command ships at pretty much everything. The command ships niche got pushed back with the introduction of teir 2 BC's, but it got absolutely destroyed by the introduction of T3's. I believe that it is far past time to bring them back.
Ok, I will admit though, I do have command ship 5 because of slepnir... and I hate flying T3's due to that possibility of skillpoint loss.
-Arazel
try comparing 1xT3 with 3xCS, because that's how the numbers play out if you factor in ISK.
"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings" -MXZF |

Daniel Plain
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
782
|
Posted - 2013.01.23 00:21:00 -
[3] - Quote
Shilalasar wrote:When will people get this: Price is not a balancing factor! Especially not in a playerdriven economy with functioning supply/demand. Otherwise we would still have titans with aoe-doomsday.
not sure if trolling or just insanely stupid.
"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings" -MXZF |

Daniel Plain
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
784
|
Posted - 2013.01.24 01:30:00 -
[4] - Quote
Shilalasar wrote:Daniel Plain wrote:Shilalasar wrote:When will people get this: Price is not a balancing factor! Especially not in a playerdriven economy with functioning supply/demand. Otherwise we would still have titans with aoe-doomsday.
not sure if trolling or just insanely stupid. Not sure if NPC trolling or just too insanly stupid to get how economy or even just this game works.
you have two ships that fulfill the same role. one can be produced by anyone and requires 1000 tritanium to build, the other one must be built from special resources that you only get from reprocessing 100 officer modules and also has a 5 month build time and 5 years in industry skill requirements. your balancing goal is to make both ships viable i.e. people should have incentives to fly both. do you make both ships equally powerful?
"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings" -MXZF |